For this week’s Critical Lenses journal entry, please focus
on archetypal criticism. In your post write two paragraphs, each focused on
identifying and exploring the narrative designs, character types, or images
from your novel that can be viewed as archetypal. How does your novel reflect
the universal patterns seen in other literature? What response is the use of
these patterns meant to elicit from you, the reader? What other literature or
cultural artifacts utilize a similar pattern? Be sure to reference the novel
and use textual support for your answers.
The father type figure is Armstid because he took Lena in and gave her a place to stay. Lena is the protagonist and is pregnant with no husband and that is frowned upon. The bad person in the beginning of the story is Lucas because he had sex with Lena and then left her. Armstid is also the rebel hero because it wrong to be pregnant and not married but he is helping Lena anyways. These are what I know so far but later on in the story we will find out more
ReplyDeleteI saw this too, except for I didn't see Lucas as being the bad guy necessarily.
DeleteHe had sex with Lena and then left her out to dry. How is that not being a bad guy
DeleteIn the novel Tom Sawyer by Mark Twain It starts out with a sort of argument between the child Tom Sawyer and his guardian. This represents Archetypal criticism because of how this child treats his gardian who is his deceased mother's sister.
ReplyDeleteTom sawyer distracts his guardian and then runs away. This goes against the theory of how youth should respect there elders.
In the novel Shane by Jake Schaefer, Shane's archetype is The Caregiver. He helps Joe against the antagonist, Fletcher, and is one of Joe's best friends throughout the story.
ReplyDeleteFletcher is The Ruler. He wants to take over all the farmer's land in the area.
great job, i agree
DeleteShane, a novel by Jake Schrieffer, is a western like book. the main character, Shane, plays a caregiver. he helps is dad fight against the antagonist named Fletcher who wants to take all the farmers land
ReplyDeleteVery good. Except, Shane doesn't help his won father, he helps Bob's father.
DeleteIn the book Light in August, I see Armstid as being a caring man, because he took Lena and let her spend the night, knowing that she didn't really have a place to stay, since she was on a journey to go find the father of the child she's bearing. This is suppose to show that there are good men out there that are willing to help someone out when they are in need.
ReplyDeleteByron Burch in my opinion is seen as a working man, looking for a wife. When Lena interrupts his work, he talks to her, and falls in love with her. He then realizes that she is looking for the father of her baby and says he has never heard of the man she is looking for. Byron is seen as a strong man, worthy of being wedded.
I agree with evertyhing said here and I like Armstid. Do you?
DeleteYes
DeleteYes
DeleteGone With the Wind by Margaret Mitchell is a novel about a love story back in the civil war time period. Scarlett, the main character, has an archetype that is characterized as a heroic figure. She is struggling and attempting to twist life to suit her own wishes. It traces her through the history of the south during the Civil war and reconstruction. It goes over her tangled love affairs with Ashley and Rhett.
ReplyDeleteA Journey to the Center of the Earth, written by Jules Verne, begins by establishing the environment Harry (or Axel in the original book) is accustomed too. He lives a rich and plentiful life with his extremely smart, but seemingly insane uncle. At the house, they also have a cook. This part of the story is part of the known. Then, Harry's uncle, Hardwigg (or professor Otto Lindenbrock in the original), found a piece of writing by Arne Saknussemm, an Icelandic alchemist. Neither Hardwigg nor Harry knew what the paper said. Hardwigg refused to let them eat or sleep until the paper wad decoded. Harry eventually figured it out, the writing was written backwards. He discovered that the paper was directions to get to the center of the Earth. Harry did not want to tell his uncle because he knew Hardwigg would make Harry go too. Eventually though, Harry told him because he couldn't handle not eating or sleeping anymore. This part of the book is the call of adventure. I believe Harry and Hardwigg pass the threshold when they complete their voyage to Iceland and are welcomed by Baron Trampe - the governor of the island, M. Finsen - the mayor, and M. Fridriksson - professor of natural science in the college of Reykjavik. After resting up, they meet Hans, their guide, and begin the journey to a mountain that is suppose to be the entrance to the center of the Earth. Hans is also one of the helpers in this story. On their way, they stop at a few houses that allow them to rest for the night. Now they're on their way to scale the mountain and begin the unknown part of the journey.
ReplyDeleteThis book reflects the universal patterns seen in other literature by following the Hero's Journey. There is the known and unknown. The characters cross the threshold into the unknown after being called to adventure. They also receive Hans, who I think is a helper. The use of these patterns are meant to elicit a response of awe and familiarity from me. The book is set up in an almost fairy-like way and the Hero's Journey makes it seem like a familiar story that I can't quite remember. Some of the older Disney princess films utilize a similar pattern. They use the Hero's Journey and also the time period that The Journey to the Center of the Earth has. Snow White and Sleeping Beauty both come to mind when I think bout similar cultural artifacts. Snow White had a poison apple and Aurora had a spinning wheel.
I agree with you on the fact that this book follows the Hero's Journey. However the Hero's Journey is a really broad category. Is there another category of idea that could be used to make the theme of the story more specific. Also I agree with how it remind you some of the old Disney Princesses but can you find any modern examples?
DeleteAnother archetype that this book has is the explorer. I think that Harry and Hardwigg fit this type, even though Harry is kind of dragged along and forced into it. More modern examples could include some of the recent Marvel movies. Deadpool made his own adventure after he was experimented on, he decided to pave his own path. Hardwigg also decided to pave his own path, and took Harry along. Deadpool also pulls quite a few people with him. Each story had a chance to turn a different way. Deadpool could have gone back to his love instead of tracking down the people that experimented on him and Harry could have ignored the paper and refused to go on the adventure.
DeleteMy archetype for Pride and Prejudice was hero because the book is all about her and her journey of growing up and learning about love and herself. Elizabeth Bennet lives with her mother, father and sisters in the English countryside. As the oldest child, she faces pressure from her parents to marry. When Elizabeth is introduced to an upper-class gyu, Mr. Darcy sparks fly. Although there is obvious chemistry between the two, Darcy's insecurities threatens their relationship.
ReplyDeleteIt's interesting how the pressure seems to be all towards Elizabeth. Why do you think it's put on the oldest child, not the second oldest or youngest?
DeleteIn "The Red Badge of Courage", the soldiers are very doubtful. The soldiers were told that they were going to battle the next day but doubt it because they were told that 8 times in the last 2 weeks. Henry is a soldier who has been ready for battle since a child but is not ready when it is time to go. Henry wonders if his people will be hero's like the Greeks or be killed.
ReplyDeleteI'm thinking the archetype for "The Red Badge of Courage" is hero because Henry often is thinking that he is a hero. As he goes through the camps during the Civil War, he is starting to question himself, often like people do today. The times were getting hard for him and he considered running away from the war. Too often today, when times get tough, people try to run away from their problems like Henry. I am also thinking that this story could follow Hero's Journey. He could be starting this journey and come out as a war hero.
In the novel "Little Women" the hero of the story seems to be Jo March. She's a fifteen year old and isn't afraid to speak her mind and is unapologetically herself. She wished that she could go fight with her father in the Civil War, but obviously cannot. She hates that she has to act like a "proper young lady" because during the time of this novel women didn't have many rights and were expected to act proper and classy. She doesn't seem to like her name Josephine because it's feminine so she goes by Jo, which seems like a more masculine name.
ReplyDeleteIn the novel Animal Farm, there are a lot of characters. One of the main heroic characters of the story is, Major, an old pig. The first chapter is all about Major telling the rest of the barnyard animals how they can be treated better if they overrun the humans. It's said by an ancient song that Major sings that if the animals overrun the humans, they can get easier jobs, more pay, less hours of work, and more time to play. At the beginning of chapter two, Major dies, putting the pressure on all the other barnyard animals to get what he failed to do done.
ReplyDeleteIn the Novel, Kidnapped by Robert Stevenson one of the main characters was dealing with a death. David, a teenager is coping with a recent loss of his dad passing away. By this beginning, I am waiting to see if this is a symbol that reflect later. David is now a orphan due to loosing both parents.
ReplyDeleteLater, David then meets up with his uncle again. David does not know what to think. I am really interested in all these meet ups that David has had on where they are going.
I didn't see his coping as being a big aspect as to why he he left to go to the unknown destination called Shaws but you make a good point. What do you think his character type is?
DeleteI have had a hard time coming up with his charcter type.
DeleteIn "Catch-22"a lot of the characters display patterns that are seen throughout many novels. Doc Daneeka could be one example of a pattern seen in many novels. He is the doctor for the war base Yossarian is located at. Everyday the doctor does the same thing, sit around an complain about how he was drafted into the war and how he wanted no part of it. Yossarian is the main character, who tends to visit the doc daily, asking if he can be grounded.
ReplyDeleteBoth of these men are an example of a common pattern, a cancer of the group. Every group in every story has something that holds back someone or something from accomplishing their goals. In this case, Yossarian and the doc are unproductive and are cancers in the war base because of their negative attitudes. The reaction I have to this is that if a captain and a doctor in the air force don't want to be there, that is probably the attitude for most of the soldiers. They seem crazy as well, which I believe is something that battle causes.
In what other books are there examples of cancers to the group?
DeleteOf Mice and Men, Curley would be an example of a cancer.
DeleteIn "Catch-22" the main character is named Yossarian. He's an air force captain in World War 2 and has to fly a certain amount of mission to get out of the war. This happens in lots of books where a character has to achieve to something to get a reward. In "Of Mice and Men" George and Lennie have to make money to get the house they want. Often, the character is faced with an issue so they can't reach this reward.
ReplyDeleteThe issue in "Catch-22" is Colonel Cathcart. He's in the book to make the readers and Yossarian angry by what he does to Yossarian. Every time Yossarian has completed the amount of missions he needs to go home, Cathcart raises the amount he needs. The example of this in "Of Mice and Men" is Curley who causes problems for George and Lennie. These examples show that archetypal criticism occurs throughout many books.
Why do you think it is that the author created the "Catch-22" rule? Was it to show how war life really was or was it just to have something to keep Yossarian there?
DeleteI feel it was a little of both. The author wants to show that war is bad and he needed something that would drive Yossarian and the others insane.
DeleteIn "Lord Of The Flies" there are several main characters one of them is Ralph. He is the leader of the group. I believe he is the to represent the law and civilization we have in our world. He is also very athletic in the book. He is leader from the very beginning and he is not worried about taking charge of the others. He just wants to do a good job and lead the others safely. He is the least adventurous of them all.
ReplyDeleteIn 'Lord of the Flies' Jack is the character that causes problems for everyone. He is the one that stands in the way of Ralph and his goals. He is also athletic, and very strong headed, just like Jack, that's why they have such a hard time getting along.
I definitely agree with what you say about Ralph representing the law and civilization. Do you think that he will be a good leader though and help them get off the island safely?
DeleteNo I don't think he thinks enough before deciding what to do and I think he needs to talk with the others more. I predict that people will get mad and begin to rebel against him.
DeleteThe book of Kidnapped by Robert Louis Stevenson is a fiction novel. From the beginning of the book, the main character, David Balfour, comes off as a character of the rebel-hero type. He is set off on a journey, like most heroes, to deliver a letter and as he is making his way, the townspeople tell him that he shouldn’t be doing what he is doing, therefore putting the rebel characteristic in him. Another way that David is rebellious is that he goes against the Captain's commands in order to help a fellow stranger that soon becomes his companion. He was suppose to retrieve weapons for the Captain’s so that they could kill the intruder on the ship but instead he used the weapons against the captain’s, killing many of their men. By this, does it show the hero side of the rebel-hero characteristic.
ReplyDeleteUncle Ebenezer also seems to be a very important character as he appears the be the first form of evil that David faces. He may have provided david with food, shelter and company (paradise), but he also would lock him in the pitch dark basement, make him act as a servant, and nearly almost killed him on purpose on two occasions (Hades or evil). Another way that evil is shown through the character of Uncle Ebenezer is when he reveals that he actually killed David's father so that he could get money, land, and power.
A common pattern within the first 100 pages of this novel seems to be betrayal. Uncle Ebenezer had betrayed the family, his brother in particular as he killed him out of greed for power and money. Another point of betrayal appears when David decides to take the stranger's side instead of following Captain’s orders.
I agree with your point of view. I really think the same about the pattern.
DeleteDid you notice any other patterns while reading? I struggled with coming up with just one
DeleteDid you notice any other patterns while reading? I struggled with coming up with just one
DeleteIn 'White Fang' there are very few characters. Ben and Henry are the two characters that have been introduced so far in the book. Ben is this bold person that wants to fight off the wolves that are lingering behind them and killing their dogs. He wants to shoot to kill yet only has three bullets so he holds off. He wants the best for his dogs yet one is lured off and killed almost every night. Ben tries to save a dog at one point and is killed by the wolves and eaten. He had courage and that got the better of him.
ReplyDeleteTogether these two are like damsels in distress. There is not much they can do to fight off these hungry wolves. At night they set up their fire which saves them but not their dogs. With very little daylight hours in Alaska they don't have much time to travel on sled, which doesn't help. Henry is alone after Ben is killed and Henry has to fight off the wolves. He uses fire to keep them back which works well. He has no dogs left since they have been eaten. This book is already showing sings of Hero's Journey and I'm not that far into it. They are on this call of adventure and face the hungry pack of wolves, the trials. Henry has just gotten through a big crisis and I see a turning point coming later in the book. This would complete the cycle. Hero's Journey is used in many books and movies. Hercules is a good example as many other Disney movies are. Hercules fights a crisis and has a turning point which I see happening in this book.
I agree, I also see the beginning of the hero's journey archetype in the first few chapters of the book. It is interesting to compare the two main characters to damsels in distress, seeing how they are male. Where did you get that idea?
DeleteWhile having a conversation about the journal topic damsels in distress were brought up for an idea. I thought that connected to the book how the two main characters couldn't do much about what was going on around them. They were in distress so I thought this comparison was a great idea.
DeleteThe beginning of the book does a great good starting up the hero's journey, I agree.
DeleteI think that this book is a great example of hero's journey.
Delete"Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea" by Jules Verne shows similar patterns to other works of literature. The books starts off with a mysterious creature of the sea that has been attacking ships in ways never seen before. The mythical creature is capable of puncturing large holes ships with metal over an inch thick. A team is assembled to find and purge the animal from the sea.
ReplyDeleteThe novel also reflects universal patterns seen in other works of literature by following the path of hero's journey. Professor Aronnax receives his call to adventure when he receives a letter inviting him on the expedition to find the alleged giant narwhal.
I agree with you that Professor Aronnax recieves a call to adventure in this story but is he the protagonist of the story? Is this how we are to determine Archetypal criticism? From what I read it seemed like something that it was important to compare the character development to other literature.
DeleteI do think that the professor is the protagonist of the story. I agree that I should have talked more about character development for this lens.
DeleteIn the novel, "Pride and Prejudice" by Jane Austen, it seems like a lot of predictably quarrelsome situations will be present throughout the whole story. By reading just the first page, I noticed that this story was going to be focused around its title ("Pride and Prejudice"). It begins by focusing on the fact that a couple with five unmarried daughters finds out that a very wealthy, single man bought a well-known park they enjoy. They seem to be excited about it, wanting one of their daughters to get involved with him. I take this as archetypal because it's almost foreshadowing the fate of one of the daughters.
ReplyDeleteTo me, in most books I have read, the author usually writes out in the first chapter something that can easily be seen through archetypal lens. This seems to be a pattern. To get someone hooked, you need to draw them in by allowing them to predict what will happen. An example of another book doing this is "To Kill a Mockingbird", because they start off with information people don't know much about, and at the end, things are revealed and the beginning starts to make sense.
Good point about noticing patterns with different novels about how different authors do somewhat the same things to help readers understand. Do you think it personally helps you more and more when you see the pattern continuing in harder, more academic and mature books?
DeleteYes, it definitely would help seeing the archetypal lens in other harder books. As I read more and more, I'm sure I'll notice this lens as well as others in stories.
DeleteThe classic novel of "The Count of Monte Cristo" written by Alexandre Dumas starts of like most books and immediately starts with a problem. It begins like a lot of other famous books start off and that is jealously. A supercargo for the ship by the name of Danglars becomes jealous of the ship's first mate and attempts to undermine his record. Jealously seems to be a popular topic in the world of literature and it is a perfect emotion to start a problem off of. This small problem that was later fixed gave the reader a good background of what the characters were going to be like in the book.
ReplyDeleteWhile the problem stated may not be the problem the novel is focused around, it helps give a background of the characters that I am most likely going to read about. Unlike most books, this novel gave the reader key information about who will most likely be the main characters. While other books tend to develop their characters slowly, this book brought out the emotions and feeling of the characters right away in chapter 1.
I agree that the novel starts off with plentiful amounts of jealousy. However, does the small problem of the main character (so far) being undermined actually resolve? I believe that the resolution will be closer to the end of the novel rather than the problem being solved in just the first chapter.
DeleteI believe that some characters in the book at this point indeed do believe that the problem has been solved. I have a feeling that throughout the book and towards the end, like you said, this minor problem will come back and haunt one of the characters.
DeleteI agree that the novel starts off with plentiful amounts of jealousy. However, does the small problem of the main character (so far) being undermined actually resolve? I believe that the resolution will be closer to the end of the novel rather than the problem being solved in just the first chapter.
DeleteSo far "White Fang" is about survival. More specifically, survival from a pack of wolves. Ben and Henry are sled drivers who are trying to protect their dogs. The wolves slowly pick off the dogs one at a time. Eventually, Ben is attacked and killed by the wolves. This gives the book a sad tone and establishes the wolves as the enemy for now.
ReplyDeleteEven though there is only a couple of characters, patterns are starting to form. For instance, trying to fight nature is a common sequence that can be found in many books. It leads me to believe that sooner or later they will be forced to be at peace with the wolves. I suppose the book started off this way to make the readers think about who the real antagonist is.
Are the wolves antagonists' though or is it just a single wolf that is the antagonist?
DeleteThough we have just started reading our independent books, have you seen any examples so far yet of survival in the book? Sounds like a very intense, interesting novel.
DeleteIt is too soon to tell. I am anxious to find out
DeleteIn the book I am reading, White Fang, there are only two human main characters, one of which dies pretty quick. Ben and Henry are the only characters we have met so far, except for the wolves, who aren’t the nicest entities. There is a famine going on so all the wolves are like starving so they start hunting the dogs that are pulling the sled. One of them wants to shoot to kill but he only has three bullets so he has to hold back. He wants the best for his dogs yet one is lured off and killed almost every night. Ben is trying to to save one of the dogs, but gets knocked off by the wolves. He was too arrogant and it was the death of him.
ReplyDeleteBen exemplifies the hero archetype when he tries to save the dog. He is trying to be a hero and save the dog, but then he dies in the process, ending his hero’s journey. Another archetype shown would be the mother figure archetype. This is shown when the she-wolf gives birth to the litter of pups, one who becomes White Fang. Through this we are starting to see a hero’s journey in White Fang. He has an interesting circumstances around his birth, being born in a litter during a famine. Another archetype shown is the fight for survival. This happens in lots of books, here it is the wolves fighting for their survival, being low on food, they eat the dogs, and the man.
I am wondering how White Fang will become part of the plot, since his mother is the she-wolf will it be taken care of or ignored?
ReplyDeleteI think they will be taken care of for a while, but who knows, I'm just guessing for now.
DeleteIn “The Pearl” by John Steinbeck, The main character, Kino, has an archetype of a man who values his family deeply and is the main victim of the Pearl throughout the story. He is a young Mexican man living on the beach of La Paz in a small hut with his wife, Juana, and son, Coyotito. He faces many challenges with his life that seems in the beginning to only be on simplicity. From the very first page, It talks about how he can hear the waves of the ocean.This helps me infer that it is fairly quiet and serene. I am excited to see how this novel continues.
ReplyDeleteI like how you could infer that is it quiet and serene by just starting to get an idea of what the book is about.
DeleteAs I read further into my book, it is a lot easier to sort out all of the confusing details.
DeleteAs I read further into my book, it is a lot easier to sort out all of the confusing details.
DeleteAlready just from the first little bit of “Lord of the Flies,” I can tell that the main archetype is the hero archetype. The main character, Ralph, is going to be the hero on a hero’s journey because so far he is the main one who has shown initiative and got stuff done. Many young people got stranded on an island but were separated. This was his call to adventure; to get everyone back home safely. Ralph is not only smart but also clever. He uses a conch shell, which sounds like a trumpet, to summon the others from the island to come together. On the other hand, he can be rude and uninterested so that could lead to problems when issues arise. I’m eager to see what challenges they will face together and if his cleverness will get them out of it.
ReplyDeleteRalph sets up something that represents a democracy and people vote for who they want to be chief. Obviously Ralph wins this little election. Jack was already in charge of the choir group so that stays the same but he is also kind of like Ralph’s helper. He is more dark and rebellious than Ralph and he shows that through many of his actions. Although Ralph is the main guy in charge, I also wonder if Piggy will have a bigger part in the book. He is the one who helped Ralph with everything and even cared enough to learn people’s names. However, Ralph has more characteristics of a leader than Piggy. Piggy so far has mainly sat on the sidelines and done what h was told to do but I’m curious to see if that will change.
I agree that Ralph will be the one that leads them into the right direction, however I think he isn't the best leader. I think he just wants to do stuff to get it over with and get off the island. I don't think he thinks enough before making a decision. I think that people will start to get mad at him and that it will cause lots of problems. I also agree with you saying that Piggy is not be a big part in the book. However I don't think that he will become a big part because the author didn't care enough to give him a real name.
DeleteI agree with you saying that Ralph won't be the best leader. He doesn't seem to actually care about the little kids who can't even care for themselves. I feel like Ralph and Jack think a lot differently though and that it will lead to a conflict later on.
DeleteThe book "A Journey to the Center of the Earth" by Jules Verne is a classic. It's about Harry who lives with his genious and almost insane Uncle Hardwigg. He lives in a nice house with an old cook and a maid. One day Harry's uncle comes home with writing that he or Harry don't understands. Uncle Hardwigg gets so into solving it that he say no food or sleep until the figure out what it says.
ReplyDelete"A Journey to the Center of the Earth" by Jules Verne is sort of like most books. Most books have a protagonist and antagonist. However in "A Journey to the Center of the Earth" doesn't really have antagonist. The protagonist is Harry. It follows a story plot of how it seems to be getting more and more interesting as you read. Also an example of Archetypal Criticism is the parchment that Uncle Hardwigg found.
Are there any more reasons for why this book is sort of like most books? You weren't very clear about what separates this book from other books. Did you mean that "A Journey to the Center of the Earth" is different from other books because an antagonist hasn't been identified yet? I believe we just haven't read far enough to discover the antagonist in this book. I have a feeling that this book will most likely be self vs nature, do you agree? I agree with you when you say that Harry is the protagonist. I also think that the plot started quite ordinary and the farther you go, the more complex it gets. I don't really see how Hardwigg's parchment is an example of Archetypal criticism. If you could explain yourself better, I might understand what you mean.
DeleteSo far with how much I have read in the book it seem like a normal book. There have been no events that clearly stand out from the rest of the book. Also yes U meant different but you probably correct about the antagonist coming in later in the book. I also believe that this book will be self vs. nature. Also with Archetypal critisim there is some sort of event or object that people know about like how people know of the Greek Gods and the Demigods like Hercules. The parchment seems like it will play an important role in the book later on as it is now. So it clearly stands out a little.
DeleteSo far in George Orwell's "Animal Farm", there is one character that seems like the leader or hero that gets the ball rolling, and draws attention to an idea. The character is Major, a very old pig. He is very old and wise and knows his way around the subject he speaks of. He claims that if all the animals of the world rebel against humanity, they could put an end to the slavery, and lead the animal kingdom to prosperity and freedom. The animals on this particular farm agree with the idea and form a type of committee in which they discuss ways to solve problems and prepare for the rebellion.
ReplyDeleteMajor is the hero figure because he has struggled through his life trying to change the way life on the farm works. He wants humanity to be eradicated because they are "The only creature that consumes without producing."(29) Major had spent most of his life thinking about ways to make change and finally he discovered it. He called the meeting and influenced many perspectives on life. The underlying theme of his speech is about how people running the governments are corrupted and don't care about society, or the people's well being.
What other character in a different story do you think that the Major can connect to or is similar to?
DeleteWhat other character in a different story do you think that the Major can connect to or is similar to?
DeleteIn Ernest Hemmingway's "A Farewell to Arms", the narrator is Lieutenant Henry, who is currently in an Italian village during the summer in the midst of war. The narrative is in first person, and surprisingly in-depth to the surroundings. In chapter one, we get a detailed view of the environment and surroundings through man details put together. Sentences like "The vineyards were thin and barebranched too and all the country wet and brown and dead with the autumn." or "There was much traffic at night and many mules on the roads with boxes of ammunition on each side of their pack-saddles..." really help paint a picture, and make the setting really clear to the reader.
ReplyDeleteAnd since the narrative is in first person, it leads me to believe that this character is the protagonist. Usually first person narratives have to be from a character of importance, as we can see in books like "The Hunger Games", and this character also doesn't seem to relish in conflict. This can be seen when his fellow officers, who don't want anything to do with religion, start talking smack about the military priest. Henry acts good naturedly towards the priest, even though he doesn't believe in God himself.
I agree on this that the settings are imaginable from the quotes like "The vineyards were thin and bare branched too and all the country wet and brown and dead with the autumn." and "There was much traffic at night and many mules on the roads with boxes of ammunition on each side of their pack-saddles." With so much discription it's easy to picture what's happening and what everything looks like. Although It was hard for me at first to see who was talking but then it got easier. I realized how Lieutenant Henry was so kind towards others and I assumed he was religious when he isn't but respects religion. He is the story teller and described to be the protagonist like Hannah says.
ReplyDeleteIn "A Farewell to Arms" by Ernest Hemingway the settings are imaginable from the quotes like "The vineyards were thin and bare branched too and all the country wet and brown and dead with the autumn." and "There was much traffic at night and many mules on the roads with boxes of ammunition on each side of their pack-saddles." With so much discription it's easy to picture what's happening and what everything looks like. Although It was hard for me at first to see who was talking but then it got easier. I realized how Lieutenant Henry was so kind towards others and I assumed he was religious when he isn't but respects religion. He is the story teller and described to be the protagonist.
ReplyDeleteWhat do you think might happen as the story progresses?
DeleteSlaughterhouse-Five, by Kurt Vonnegut, starts off as a man trying to write a book about the war he had been involved in. He was trying to re-collect information and memories from the war. He had written a few books and they had been published. One book he wrote about was of a man named Billy Pilgrim. Billy could go to any time in his life, past, present or future. He had suffered a lot of losses and had several injuries. He had lost his mother, father and wife, suffered a nerve collapse and survived a plane crash with injuries all within a few short years. The novel then goes on and goes into Billy talking about his experience in the war and how he could go into any time in his life.
ReplyDeleteBilly’s ability to go to any point in his life makes it easy to read with a archetypal lens. Other novels use a similar concept of time travel to make the plot interesting. Another aspect of using an archetypal lens in this novel is using the war and death. Other authors use war and death to bring action and grab the reader’s attention. I believe my novel somewhat reflects others work in the way of using the time travel concept but it is portrayed in, I’d say, a unique way.
I agree that when looking through this archetypal lens it is very easy to compare many science fiction novels to this particular novel. What do you think sets his unique way of writing about time travel different from others?
DeleteIt isn't necessarily time travel, it is just going to different parts of his life, even before and after his death. It was used in a different way than other books.
DeleteI am reading "The Light in the Forrest" by Conrad Richter.
ReplyDeleteOne obvious archetype I have noticed in the book is segregation by skin color. A boy, True Son, is forced away from his adoptive American Indian family by Englishmen simply because they believe he would be more comfortable with people of his own skin color. Another book that I have read that displays this archetype is "Trouble's daughter" by Kathrine Kirkpatrick. A girl is taken from her adoptive tribe to live back in England.
Another evident archetype in "The Light in the Forrest" is the fish out of water archetype. True Son is thrown out of the only home he has known to be with a race of people that seem strange to him. To make things worse, he is expected to be like these people. He is expected to know how to act like these people when he as never been around them. I feel that this archetype is fundamental part of the story and will continue to be a common theme throughout the book.
I couldn't agree with you more.
DeleteI think there's a lot of criticism in this story. Whites vs. Indians because the Indians don't understand the whites and the whites don't respect the Indians. Both the races kill each other after one race makes mistakes and instead of trying to teach the whites how to use everything the Earth offers and be more passive the Indians become angry at their stupidity and kill them for trespassing on their land. The whites then become angry with the Indians and kill them.
I think another archetype is pride. Each race has so much pride in themselves. True Son keeps saying, "I am an Indian" and that it true but the meaning behind it holds strength and more of a meaning. Whites often call True Son "Injuns" which is a dirty term that people called the offspring of an affair in the Victorian Era "bastard". The term references whites better than white children who were taken under the wing of Indians.
Today these themes can be commonly applied to today problems in political circles or ethical rings or religion aspects. It's an endless cycle that humanity constantly goes through and one that we can never raise ourselves above.
I am reading "The Light in the Forrest" by Conrad Richter.
ReplyDeleteOne obvious archetype I have noticed in the book is segregation by skin color. A boy, True Son, is forced away from his adoptive American Indian family by Englishmen simply because they believe he would be more comfortable with people of his own skin color. Another book that I have read that displays this archetype is "Trouble's daughter" by Kathrine Kirkpatrick. A girl is taken from her adoptive tribe to live back in England.
Another evident archetype in "The Light in the Forrest" is the fish out of water archetype. True Son is thrown out of the only home he has known to be with a race of people that seem strange to him. To make things worse, he is expected to be like these people. He is expected to know how to act like these people when he as never been around them. I feel that this archetype is fundamental part of the story and will continue to be a common theme throughout the book.
In Treasure Island by Robert Stevenson, the archetype of the main character, Jim, would definitely be hero. Since the beginning of the book, Jim has always been helping people and having a heroic personality. He helps Bill when he had a stroke and was in trouble, He runs the inn when his dad had died, and he rescued his mother and brought her to safety when the inn was overran by people looking for Bill's chest.
ReplyDeleteThese traits for Jim are not only heroic, but could also give him a caretaker archetype. Jim is the type of person to help out anyone in need. He took care of his father when he was sick, he took care of Bill when he had a stroke, He helped others who came into the inn, and he helped his mom when she was in trouble. Jim's personality gives him multiple archetypes in this story.
In Slaughterhouse Five, by Kurt Vonnegut, the author opens the first chapter with more of an autobiography, unlike most novels, about attempting to write a story of his experiences in war. After visiting with an old war buddy, Vonnegut explains why this book may never work out. He claims to have not been able to recall enough about the details. After a failed trip to Dresden, Germany to try to recollect his thoughts about his involvement in this World War 2 battle he decides it's best to just scratch that idea. The beginning of this book is more of a preface rather than a chapter. Although, throughout this chapter, Vonnegut does drop some hints about Billy Pilgrim and what he may experience.
ReplyDeleteIn the next chapter the author is quick to jump into the novel itself. The chapter springs right into the concept of time travel and never really looks back. Many other science fiction novels use the concept of time travel, which may be why it is a little easier to understand. When reading through this archetypal lens, you can also connect innocence and people being victimized, this connects with other authors styles of writing. Victims are used to give the reader a reaction or make them feel emotion which is used so commonly and in almost every book. In Dresden, there are many victims, seeing as it was bombed brutally and Billy survives. Which leads into war and death, this is also so widespread throughout almost every book including this one, referring back to World War 2, specifically the bombing of Dresden.
I agree that it brings together many styles of writing. The book is interesting due to the choice of how it was written. Why do you feel it was written this way?
DeleteI feel like Vonnegut wrote the novel in this way mainly to intrigue the reader. I don't believe we have gotten far enough into the book to really understand why he did it this way. Do you have an opinion on why he may have written in such a style as this one?
DeleteIn Treasure Island by Robert Stevenson, the archetype of the main character, Jim, would definitely be hero. Since the beginning of the book, Jim has always been helping people and having a heroic personality. He helps Bill when he had a stroke and was in trouble, He runs the inn when his dad had died, and he rescued his mother and brought her to safety when the inn was overran by people looking for Bill's chest.
ReplyDeleteThese traits for Jim are not only heroic, but could also give him a caretaker archetype. Jim is the type of person to help out anyone in need. He took care of his father when he was sick, he took care of Bill when he had a stroke, He helped others who came into the inn, and he helped his mom when she was in trouble. Jim's personality gives him multiple archetypes in this story.
the novel 20,000 leagues a sea shows archetypal criticism. Commander Farragut is a strong ignorant man who does his job well. He is a captain, not a scientist.He is Clearly close minded like many strong characters in other literature. Conseil is clearly an easily ordered character. He is Obediant and similar to an Igor type character. these type of characters are clearly identifiable in different types of literature.
ReplyDeleteI do not agree that Frarragut would be characterized as an ignorant man. What did he do that makes you think this?
DeleteThe way Farragut blatantly mocks professor Aronnax. Farragut´s only mission seems to be to kill the creature,he disregards the science behind it. Perhaps he is not an ignorant man overall, but his vision is made to be a tunnel by his mission.
ReplyDeletethats for Stephanie
DeleteIn the book The Call of the Wild the main character is a dog. The dog thinks of himself as the ruler because he doesn't have to stay in a kennel or in the house. Most of the other dogs were kept in their kennels most of the time. He can roam where ever he wants until he is taken from his home. One of the gardener's helpers took the dog and sold him. The dog was roped and fought back, just like a normally free dog would.
ReplyDeleteThe Count of Monte Cristo, written by Alexandre Dumas,begins with copious amounts of jealousy. In the first chapter of the novel the main character, Edmond Dantes, is told he will be the captain of the ship that he was first mate on since the first captain died. This creates jealousy between Edmond and another shipmate named Danglars. Because of this jealousy, Danglars then tries to outsmart Edmond so he can become the captain of the ship instead. So far, the entire book is just filled with jealousy. In chapter four, Edmond goes to visit his fiance since he gets to stay home for three months. There, he encounters more jealousy from his fiance’s cousin who is trying to get her to marry him instead of Edmond. She stays true to him though, and then he comes back to see her and marry her.
ReplyDeleteThese problems that start the novel out are probably not the problems that the entire book revolves around, but they help to set up character’s positions in the novel. Most books take a very long time to develop characters but this book did not. It also adds a lot of important background information that will later be needed to understand things. Unlike most other novels, this book brings out the variety of emotions of the characters and gives more addition to the story starting on the first page.
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ReplyDeleteI think there's a lot of criticism in this story. Whites vs. Indians because the Indians don't understand the whites and the whites don't respect the Indians. Both the races kill each other after one race makes mistakes and instead of trying to teach the whites how to use everything the Earth offers and be more passive the Indians become angry at their stupidity and kill them for trespassing on their land. The whites then become angry with the Indians and kill them.
ReplyDeleteI think another archetype is pride. Each race has so much pride in themselves. True Son keeps saying, "I am an Indian" and that it true but the meaning behind it holds strength and more of a meaning. Whites often call True Son "Injuns" which is a dirty term that people called the offspring of an affair in the Victorian Era "bastard". The term references whites better than white children who were taken under the wing of Indians.
Today these themes can be commonly applied to today problems in political circles or ethical rings or religion aspects. It's an endless cycle that humanity constantly goes through and one that we can never raise ourselves above
If you were to stereotype True Son into a stereotypical character, who would you say he was?
DeleteI probably say a high class citizen in today society that's rich. Perhaps a white man in the 1950's.
ReplyDelete